Skellern Posted June 25, 2022 Report Share Posted June 25, 2022 So I've since changed the pads, gone for a twin banjo at the MS and single brake line to each caliper. Standard tokicos. I've bled them from the nipples 😁, MS Banjo and caliper Banjo bolts. New fluids but I just can't seem to get a good feel out of the lever and today it just seemed to lose all braking and come back to the bar after a bit of making progress happened. I know I could fit cbr1000rr calipers but I don't want the expense yet. The OE ones worked really well last year.... What gives?? I'm out of answers. Doent appear to be any leaks either. Any help is 🙏. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrappy600 Posted June 25, 2022 Report Share Posted June 25, 2022 When you say you've bled them from the banjo bolts can you outline what you've been doing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srad34 Posted June 25, 2022 Report Share Posted June 25, 2022 To be fair, the stock callipers are pretty crap and might well need refreshing to get a decent lever 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skellern Posted June 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2022 1 hour ago, scrappy600 said: When you say you've bled them from the banjo bolts can you outline what you've been doing? Sorry not bled, just cracked the bolts incase there was any air trapped near by. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrappy600 Posted June 25, 2022 Report Share Posted June 25, 2022 28 minutes ago, Skellern said: Sorry not bled, just cracked the bolts incase there was any air trapped near by. Any chance you're just sucking air back in to the system via the bolts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skellern Posted June 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2022 Don't think so. Literally holding onto the lever tight.... crack the bolt... it lets a small amount of fluid out, tighten up bolt, let go of the lever. So shouldn't do. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLRS Posted June 26, 2022 Report Share Posted June 26, 2022 Some calipers have a less then ideal design. Air can get trapped in the caliper joins. One way to helpt the bubbles out is to take the calipers from the forks and change their orientation. Allow the air to get out of a hidden high spot. Spotless pistons can act as pumps to flush a load of fluid to the master cylinder. This flows way more then pumping the m/c and it's the direction air wants to go anyway. But, you have to be really careful with the fluid level. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gix Posted June 26, 2022 Report Share Posted June 26, 2022 (edited) Main issue with the brakes on these is not the calipers (although they are not the best, they work find on GSXR's). It's the master cylinder ! Change that for a decent one and then go for decent calipers.. ZZR1400 Nissins are the usual choice Edited June 26, 2022 by Gix 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David W Posted June 26, 2022 Report Share Posted June 26, 2022 18 hours ago, Skellern said: Don't think so. Literally holding onto the lever tight.... crack the bolt... it lets a small amount of fluid out, tighten up bolt, let go of the lever. So shouldn't do. That’s doing bugger all I’m afraid. Get a bleedable double banjo at the top and start there. Push the pistons right back into the calipers so that bubble can’t lurk behind them. Bleed the whole system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skellern Posted June 26, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2022 9 hours ago, David W said: That’s doing bugger all I’m afraid. Get a bleedable double banjo at the top and start there. Push the pistons right back into the calipers so that bubble can’t lurk behind them. Bleed the whole system. Cheers for the advice. Part on order followed by the above once it arrives. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skellern Posted July 4, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2022 Update: New double banjo ( bleedable ) fitted. Pistons set back into each caliper. Re bleed. Not much difference. Hmmmmm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMSMJ1 Posted July 4, 2022 Report Share Posted July 4, 2022 Are you on standard calipers? They are shit. Had the same on my 04, and then again on the gixxer K3 - just a gash caliper I found. The fancy ZX12 or ZX6 ones from 2012 ish fit nicely, as do Tokico from fireblades. Just make sure your retaining pins are nice and tight with whatever you go for 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damnthistinleg Posted July 4, 2022 Report Share Posted July 4, 2022 Is there any corrosion anywhere which is causing the seals to grip the pistons too much? The bottom of the seal grooves are a favourite spot for this. It makes the pistons/pads spring back rather than self-adjust and gives the false impression that there is air in the system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skellern Posted July 4, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2022 2 hours ago, CMSMJ1 said: Are you on standard calipers? They are shit. Had the same on my 04, and then again on the gixxer K3 - just a gash caliper I found. The fancy ZX12 or ZX6 ones from 2012 ish fit nicely, as do Tokico from fireblades. Just make sure your retaining pins are nice and tight with whatever you go for Yeah standard calipers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skellern Posted July 4, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2022 1 hour ago, Damnthistinleg said: Is there any corrosion anywhere which is causing the seals to grip the pistons too much? The bottom of the seal grooves are a favourite spot for this. It makes the pistons/pads spring back rather than self-adjust and gives the false impression that there is air in the system. Cant see any corrosion. For me I'm riding and there is bite and stopping power but not as much as there should be and the lever is coming right back before I get anything worth considering to be braking. So one finger braking is a no no as there is no power at all. Would the issue you describe cause this as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
426hemi Posted July 4, 2022 Report Share Posted July 4, 2022 Try taking the pads out and putting a block between the pistons and then bleed them, sometimes the pads can distort and they act like a spring and stop the system getting full pressure, I’ve had it happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damnthistinleg Posted July 5, 2022 Report Share Posted July 5, 2022 6 hours ago, Skellern said: Cant see any corrosion. For me I'm riding and there is bite and stopping power but not as much as there should be and the lever is coming right back before I get anything worth considering to be braking. So one finger braking is a no no as there is no power at all. Would the issue you describe cause this as well? Yes, it could certainly do that but so could something else. If it were me, I'd be going for some other calipers anyway as I don't like those but if I was intent on keeping them, I'd start with a full strip, clean and rebuild with new seals throughout. A good scrape of the seal grooves would be a must, as would a very careful re-assembly with silicon grease. If it's no better after that, at least you'll know the calipers are as good as they can possibly be while you start looking elsewhere. It's often a process of elimination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skellern Posted July 5, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2022 1 hour ago, Damnthistinleg said: Yes, it could certainly do that but so could something else. If it were me, I'd be going for some other calipers anyway as I don't like those but if I was intent on keeping them, I'd start with a full strip, clean and rebuild with new seals throughout. A good scrape of the seal grooves would be a must, as would a very careful re-assembly with silicon grease. If it's no better after that, at least you'll know the calipers are as good as they can possibly be while you start looking elsewhere. It's often a process of elimination. Cheers, looks like new calipers then. Thanks for the above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gix Posted July 5, 2022 Report Share Posted July 5, 2022 your answer, matched to the zzr1400 calipers is an awesome set up https://www.facebook.com/Theracedepot/ offer on Accosatto 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arran Posted July 5, 2022 Report Share Posted July 5, 2022 I have a spare radial m/c off a later zx6r if you want it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skellern Posted July 11, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2022 On 7/5/2022 at 11:43 AM, Arran said: I have a spare radial m/c off a later zx6r if you want it? How much you want for it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arran Posted July 12, 2022 Report Share Posted July 12, 2022 £20 posted. You will need a lever though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatboy Posted July 12, 2022 Report Share Posted July 12, 2022 I junked my original calipers within months of getting my 05 ZX10R, put fireblade jobbies on, Instant transformation, never had an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bignige Posted July 12, 2022 Report Share Posted July 12, 2022 I always think that if the original road tests reported no concerns its usually a maintenance issue. Good luck! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick448 Posted July 12, 2022 Report Share Posted July 12, 2022 1 hour ago, bignige said: I always think that if the original road tests reported no concerns its usually a maintenance issue. Good luck! I'd agree, but I also guess it depends on expectation, what was deemed as good in 2005 is not necessarily the same now.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.