Adarmo Posted November 22, 2020 Report Share Posted November 22, 2020 I have a worn bearing in my KTM clutch cover. I admit I didn't look too closely but it turns out it's a split bearing (it's made in two halves) I discovered this after I'd ordered a new one £14 and they only sent 1/2 ! Why is a split bearing used ? Why would KTM sell them in halves, surely you can't just replace 1/2 a bearing ? I've googled and can't find anything except that split bearings are used for ease of renewal on large machines or to allow movement - neither seem to apply Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyJim Posted November 24, 2020 Report Share Posted November 24, 2020 Don't know much about this other than I think the RC8 engine has some in there somewhere, I recall seeing them in the workshop manual. What bike/engine is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted November 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2020 Its the 950SM but I suspect it's the same in all LC8 engines Actually I could go and have a look at the parts fiche for the later 990 superduke etc and see if they're still used Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyJim Posted November 24, 2020 Report Share Posted November 24, 2020 3 hours ago, Adarmo said: Its the 950SM but I suspect it's the same in all LC8 engines Actually I could go and have a look at the parts fiche for the later 990 superduke etc and see if they're still used Trevor Pope is very good for parts, highly recommended, and online fiche I think you are looking at part #8, it says 2 required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted November 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2020 Yes it is. I ordered from Pope but I went via the cltuch cover https://www.trevorpopemotorcycles.co.uk/index.php?main_page=ktm_fiche_finder&model=9860F0&group=2663&cat=32&bike_name=2006 950 SUPERMOTO ORANGE (AUS%2FUK)§ion=1&groupname=CLUTCH COVER Which gives you the same part number, which I put into the part finder and it came up with https://www.trevorpopemotorcycles.co.uk/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&keyword=60030026010 No pic nor mention of needing 2 I'm still intrigued why it is a split bearing (and why it costs £28) Also slightly concerned why mine is worn on a 20k bike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyJim Posted November 24, 2020 Report Share Posted November 24, 2020 46 minutes ago, Adarmo said: Yes it is. I ordered from Pope but I went via the cltuch cover https://www.trevorpopemotorcycles.co.uk/index.php?main_page=ktm_fiche_finder&model=9860F0&group=2663&cat=32&bike_name=2006 950 SUPERMOTO ORANGE (AUS%2FUK)§ion=1&groupname=CLUTCH COVER Which gives you the same part number, which I put into the part finder and it came up with https://www.trevorpopemotorcycles.co.uk/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&keyword=60030026010 No pic nor mention of needing 2 I'm still intrigued why it is a split bearing (and why it costs £28) Also slightly concerned why mine is worn on a 20k bike Yeah I see what you mean, that doesn't mention needing two. I'm guessing you didn't order over the phone then? I would have thought Rob the parts guy there would have said you needed 2. No idea why it's a split bearing, and yeah it's not great that it's worn on a 20k bike. I guess that's the joy and wonder of KTM ownership - I had worn camshafts at 12k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavey Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 Assuming this is like the rc8 motor it's in effect a third main bearing for the crank, a small one but there to support the crank and primary drive. A ball/roller bearing that would be strong enough would take up much more space, be more expensive to manufacturer and would probably have a shorter life expectancy. I'd assume like the rc8 that the oil feed for the crank is from the clutch cover, so rather important to get the bearing size right so it doesn't lose too much oil and kill the crank. You'll also need the driver and guide to fit it, and putting the case in the oven will help too. Pretty much everyone is using shell bearings on all crank positions now, stronger, cheaper and smaller than the ball/roller equivalent 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted November 29, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 Thanks but my question really is why is it split ? I've never encountered split bearings in a situation like this, why isn't it just a single round bearing ? Having tried the oven and picks etc I'm waiting for a blind bearing puller to be delivered. 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavey Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 Usually they're positioned on a split line, top and bottom of crankcases or rods. So quite possible nobody manufactures them as a complete ring. On race bikes I've occasionally built them with mis matched shells, to get clearances exactly where I need them. But it would be easier if they came in pairs Ktm are awkward for positioning them. That one is especially awkward. Fitting is almost as much fun as removal. It has to be an interference fit to stop it spinning. The Crankcase halves are almost as bad. I don't think ktm really expected them to be changed. On a road bike they'd normally never get replaced. Do you know why yours has worn, or has it got damaged during cover removal/refit? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted December 2, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2020 On 11/29/2020 at 10:56 AM, wavey said: I don't think ktm really expected them to be changed. On a road bike they'd normally never get replaced. Do you know why yours has worn, or has it got damaged during cover removal/refit? That is what's worrying me I can't find anyone who has replaced them and I bought my bike because it was low mileage, with full history as I wanted the best chance of a low hassle keeper It makes me wonder what else is worn When I bought it the oil was old and overfull but no water was in it, yet the water pump leaked immediately in my ownership 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted December 2, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2020 Here is the wear on the bearing and that's the water pump shaft which has clearly been worn and leaking for a while Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavey Posted December 2, 2020 Report Share Posted December 2, 2020 Hopefully the cover was just sitting out of place a bit, could explain the wear and the water pump leaking. If it's the same size as an rc8 bearing you can borrow my drift and collar when it's time to reassemble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted December 5, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 Thanks for the offer My bearing puller finally arrived today - heated cover in the oven to 175c and after 4 attempts - I even tried cooling the bearing with ice - it hasn't moved Not sure whether to just put it back together or risk damaging the case / taking to an engineering shop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty_The_Iceman Posted December 7, 2020 Report Share Posted December 7, 2020 Are there supposed to be locating dowels on a couple of the bolts that secure the cover to the engine cases? Has some muppet forgotten to refit them after having the cover off? Could cause a slight misalignment leading to premature wear on bearings and seals... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavey Posted December 8, 2020 Report Share Posted December 8, 2020 On 12/5/2020 at 5:06 PM, Adarmo said: Thanks for the offer My bearing puller finally arrived today - heated cover in the oven to 175c and after 4 attempts - I even tried cooling the bearing with ice - it hasn't moved Not sure whether to just put it back together or risk damaging the case / taking to an engineering shop I had to borrow a set of pullers with an internal lip so they had a face to pull against the bearing. Still tight though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
426hemi Posted December 8, 2020 Report Share Posted December 8, 2020 9 hours ago, wavey said: I had to borrow a set of pullers with an internal lip so they had a face to pull against the bearing. Still tight though. They’re called split collet bearing pullers, I’ve got a set of the Sykes pickavant ones, they work well but every now and again you get a really stubborn bearing that needs heat as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted December 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2020 On 12/8/2020 at 8:27 AM, wavey said: I had to borrow a set of pullers with an internal lip so they had a face to pull against the bearing. Still tight though. Yes that's the type I bought they come with a small slide hammer - just wouldn't budge them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavey Posted December 9, 2020 Report Share Posted December 9, 2020 Bugger! Might have to cut through it carefully with a hacksaw blade, even 3/4 through would probably be enough to remove the strength from it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaycee Posted December 9, 2020 Report Share Posted December 9, 2020 2 hours ago, Adarmo said: Yes that's the type I bought they come with a small slide hammer - just wouldn't budge them I've come across some at work that I've had to, carefully, destroy. Making sure not to damage the surface below Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
426hemi Posted December 9, 2020 Report Share Posted December 9, 2020 1 hour ago, wavey said: Bugger! Might have to cut through it carefully with a hacksaw blade, even 3/4 through would probably be enough to remove the strength from it Bearing steel can be bastard to cut with a hacksaw, propably be better buying a cheap pencil grinder with the grinding stones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted December 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2020 On 12/7/2020 at 6:48 AM, Frosty_The_Iceman said: Are there supposed to be locating dowels on a couple of the bolts that secure the cover to the engine cases? Has some muppet forgotten to refit them after having the cover off? Could cause a slight misalignment leading to premature wear on bearings and seals... Good point, but both are there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted December 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2020 22 minutes ago, 426hemi said: Bearing steel can be bastard to cut with a hacksaw, propably be better buying a cheap pencil grinder with the grinding stones. I have a cheap dremel - very rarely used but when it's required, it's priceless. Just back from my mates who had a larger slide hammer, still not moving so I'll dust off the dremel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adarmo Posted December 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2020 Well that went surprisingly well, ground through 80% still wouldn't move, ground through 90% and then bent it in on itself and it just lifted out - anyone want to buy a blind bearing puller ? 😂 I'll bask in my success tonight and will attempt to fit the new one tomorrow - that should be fun Thanks all 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeyJim Posted December 9, 2020 Report Share Posted December 9, 2020 2 hours ago, Adarmo said: Well that went surprisingly well, ground through 80% still wouldn't move, ground through 90% and then bent it in on itself and it just lifted out - anyone want to buy a blind bearing puller ? 😂 I'll bask in my success tonight and will attempt to fit the new one tomorrow - that should be fun Thanks all Well done so far, keep it up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
426hemi Posted December 10, 2020 Report Share Posted December 10, 2020 12 hours ago, Adarmo said: Well that went surprisingly well, ground through 80% still wouldn't move, ground through 90% and then bent it in on itself and it just lifted out - anyone want to buy a blind bearing puller ? 😂 I'll bask in my success tonight and will attempt to fit the new one tomorrow - that should be fun Thanks all I’d keep the bearing puller as they’re ideal for swingarm bearings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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