Anybody seen the 250bhp 2 stroke ZX 10R

[ashley]

I'm trying to read it online but can't make it out. Anybody kind enough to have a look and send me a quick resume? Make of engine etc etc?

many thanks Ash

[Liamo]

huh?

[chris675]

it is made by twostokeshop.com

it is not on their website but if you go on rgv250.co.uk and look in the hybrid bikes section there is some info in there somewhere (or you could email and ask?!)

[fredie]

have they finaly finished it . $60,000 too build i read some where. http://www.twostrokeshop.com/index.htm

[couchcommando]

Of more interest was the comment about a production run of 100 2 stroke bikes, I assume their 500cc engine in the RS250 chassis. Price £7k, again nothing on their website about it tho......£7k is doable for that tho

[wavydavy]

Of more interest was the comment about a production run of 100 2 stroke bikes, I assume their 500cc engine in the RS250 chassis. Price £7k, again nothing on their website about it tho......£7k is doable for that tho

Would I be right in guessing that it's £7k at the current exchange rate (about AU$16k ?)? By the time one got over here, I reckon you could just swap the dollar symbol for a £/€ symbol.

Of course if it were an actual £7k, then I think I might have found my new bike (but don't tell mrs.wavy)

Dave

[fredie]

just build one yourself

[wavydavy]

just build one yourself

You saying that to me ???

You have read about the NSRVF?

I know the theory (I even did bike mechanics at college a long while back) but (1) I am all thumbs, (2) I have all the patience of a pissed Glaswegian in the queue for a deep fried pizza^[1] and (3) can (just about) still afford to pay someone else to do it.

Dave

[1] I apologise to any Glaswegians reading this, it was the first analogy that popped into my head. So I thought I'd help prolong the stereotype.

[levo]

(3) can (just about) still afford to pay someone else to do it

Says the man who is having a new pool.................................

[wavydavy]

Says the man who is having a new pool.................................

Hence the 'just about' bit.........

Dave

[ashley]

Thanks guys

[Ninja & B King Boy]

Here is a reply i got from the two stroke shop a while ago, which covers the 500 bike and the one in this feature.

Thanks for writing.

As to buying whole RS500GPs, obviously the pricing is dependent on spec. New bikes are priced from £9750 and that's with OEM Aprilia running gear, with forks and rear shock sprung and damped by our GP tech to your weight and riding-scape - although most of the bikes we are currently building for customers have the HRC RS250R front end conversion with 43mm forks, and forged aluminium or magnesium wheels (depending whether road or race bikes) or BST carbon fibre wheels. Rim sizes are typically 3.5" or 3.75" fronts, and 5.5" or 5.75" rears.

These chaps are serious about giving it to the ponderous four-stroke crew!

Obviously the high-end spec options cost extra. Quite how much extra depends on the spec but to give you an idea, the brand new 43mm HRC fork legs cost around £1200, and you would have a good idea of the price of aftermarket wheels I'm sure.

Yes these additions are steep, but by crikey they aren't half worth it. They transform an already gibberingly thrilling bike into a GP machine.

But then again a lot of chaps are ordering their RS500GPs @ the base admission price of £9750 and resolving to purchase the HRC upgrade as a kit later on. Naturally the OEM Aprilia running gear can be sold to at least partly offset the price of the new components.

A cheaper way to go is to buy a TSS500GP engine kit - details here: http://www.twostrokeshop.com/TSS.htm

and build your own engine/install your own engine mounting cradle and so on. or you can go the hybrid way of buying from us a complete plug and play kit with a fully-built engine ready to drop in.

The triple-pot motors are HELLISH expensive, like £12000 for the engine/gearbox/clutch. They can be built but the only cases available for them are heavyweight things that are designed around crap unbalanced Banshee drag racing engines, and are built heavy just to stop the cases from vibrating to death. So straightaway you lose the two-stroke's inherent lightweight advantage - too much of a price to pay. Plus, you get a stronger gyro effect from the six crank webs threshing around in there, which makes the bike harder to turn in and lean over.

The other problem is packaging of pipes and maintaining ground clearance. We know this because we are actually building for an American client an 1100cc two-stroke triple in a ZX-10R chassis. Of course we tried reasoning with the dude but he was steadfast - he is bored with his Ducati 1098R and wants something with double the torque of an R1, the like of which will be able to hoist the front wheel off the throttle in top gear.

We told him the steering would be faster with a 600cc twin but he was not to be moved, chiefly because he lives in the flatlands.

Then we did some calculations and figured out that the gyro effect of the 1100cc triple two-stroke's crank is less than that of the R1 - so that after all, the stroker beast would still turn in quicker, and be lighter overall than a stock R1. It's all relative of course.

But we are talking big money; the client's budget for the bike is US$55,000. Mind, at the end of it all he will have the world's meanest and lightest sportsbike!

But back to more balanced offerings. Man, we are very happy and proud to be able to offer a viable alternative to the current four-stroke litrebike whitewash. It makes us dead happy to see one of our RS500GPs running rings around R1s and the like and to be honest the 'Stuporbikes' are just too heavy and slow to turn in to even be in with a chance.

Mind you, it could be said we are cheating, because with a 70kg rider on an RS500GP, the weight of bike and rider is about the same as a fuelled-up R1 on its own.

Now that's some serious advantage. The tyres, given they only have to deal with a fraction of the litrebike's side forces, can translate the available grip into higher cornering G-forces, higher corner speeds, and greater lean angles. Simple physics, innit.

First thing you notice is that you can brake way later and harder; run unbelievable corner speed and man, there's seemingly inexhaustible reserves of grip and lean angles. To begin with you exalt in being able to ride smoothly clip apexes just-so ... but the RS500 wants to play around a good bit more. It's at its happiest being late-braked; cogged-down and skip-hopping on corner entry; blasted out on exit; lofting front end at the slightest provocation and overall, laughing at the stodgy physics all other bikes have to adhere to.

With its low weight and sticky tyres the RS500 boasts phenomenal levels of dynamic performance; manifesting in loony corner speeds, insane lean angles and the ability to pile on the coals in situations where other bikes need to slow down or set up for the next bend. Conversely, you need only sniff at the front brake to haul speed down with such smooth, composed urgency, there's a real risk of losing nearly all your speed!

Straightline stability is solid (when front tyre is ground-bound, that is) and turn-in uproariously sharp and go-kart quick. The tiniest steering inputs will put the bike on its ear. On the RS500 you can carve turns far sharper, faster, safer, more predictably and with greater ease than on anything else. Why can't more sportsbikes be this much fun?

To be fair though, this really is a race bike with plates. Nothing else can beat it because its intent is so single-minded. You can enjoy riding the RS500 to the level of your ability/experience, true, but the bike's potential is just so awesome and the ease of accessing it so great, inevitably you'll charge off on a fanatical tarmac hobby-horse, feverish with zeal for the next roller-coaster plunge; hurling it at the scenery at unfeasibly ambitious speeds; working the positive camber; defying the negative; wheelie-steering and generally playing the exhibitionist.

And well you might, because the RS500 is so ahead of the game, it's just cheating. It has ushered in a new spectrum of road riding - one that is fast and loose, and tons of fun.

And what you are buying is a conversion that changes an already fleet machine into something so far ahead of the known riding spectrum, it's a quantum leap beyond what any R1 or R6 could ever hope to attain. And you will be safe in the knowledge that even the 2015 R1 will not be able to keep with your RS500GP around a track or on the road.

The big four-strokes are clumsy, heavy, ponderous and because the motors have to be spun up to silly revs in order to wheeze out their Norfolk-flat power delivery, this guarantees you're not having any fun on them at all until well over 100mph. Mathematically it's a cert that if you enjoy these bikes as they were designed to be ridden, you will lose your licence.

Whereas with an RS500GP, top revs is only 10,000, and strong power on board from only 6,000 - which means you CAN get your horsepower jollies even at legal road speeds.

And nothing else feels, smells, sounds and goes like a GP-bred two-stroke.

Have I convinced you yet? ;o)

Over to you, many thanks,

Steve

The Two-Stroke Shop

www.twostrokeshop.com

9 Compass Close, Edge Hill

Cairns, Queensland 4870

Australia

Tel. (In Australia): 0427 774 285

Tel. (Outside Australia): +61 427 774 285

[fredie]

http://www.twostrokeshop.com/index.htm It's simple really: machine triple billet cases to accept

3 x 366cc two-stroke cylinders with extravagant tranny porting and cutting-edge porting characteristics. Target is 250 rear wheel horsepower at 9500rpm, and just shy of DOUBLE the torque of the original ZX-10R motor. This will be easily achievable, with an engine that weighs 25kg less than the outgoing four-stroke 1000cc engine.

We can build twins up to 1146cc; triples up to 1725cc; and fours up to 2200cc. Anyone fancy pepping up their Lotus Elise or Ariel Atom?

[JBond]

We've got a long tradition of insane two strokes in the UK. Is there an importer willing to step up to the plate and bring all this stuff in? Wasn't there a rumour that Stan Stephens was building an RS500 and geting Gibson to make up the pipes.

So when you've built your RS500, I wonder what the running costs are like. 18mpg and 250 miles per litre of top spec 2T oil? New pistons every season at some god awful price?

There seem to be lots of 2T project bikes in PB at the moment. So which one of the team is mad enough to start a new one?

I imagine 2T are going to get harder and harder to find and maintain. If you have even half an interest, I figure 2009-2010 is the time to invest in a garage ornament and a drum of two stroke for the long term. By 2020 you're going to be seriously illegal but you still should be able to find a supply of Avgas.

[chris675]

stan stephens already has a 500ish in a rs250 frame it is on the website. i cant remember who did the pipes (moto3 rings a bell though)

[sennidott]

You saying that to me ???

You have read about the NSRVF?

I know the theory (I even did bike mechanics at college a long while back) but (1) I am all thumbs, (2) I have all the patience of a pissed Glaswegian in the queue for a deep fried pizza^[1] and (3) can (just about) still afford to pay someone else to do it.

Dave

[1] I apologise to any Glaswegians reading this, it was the first analogy that popped into my head. So I thought I'd help prolong the stereotype.

That should read deep fried Mars bar. All the rage in Glasgay I believe. Those 'weegies love them!

[franky]

http://www.twostrokeshop.com/index.htm It's simple really: machine triple billet cases to accept

3 x 366cc two-stroke cylinders with extravagant tranny porting and cutting-edge porting characteristics. Target is 250 rear wheel horsepower at 9500rpm, and just shy of DOUBLE the torque of the original ZX-10R motor. This will be easily achievable, with an engine that weighs 25kg less than the outgoing four-stroke 1000cc engine.

We can build twins up to 1146cc; triples up to 1725cc; and fours up to 2200cc. Anyone fancy pepping up their Lotus Elise or Ariel Atom?

I can't see who is going to pay for one of their 500cc motors...... its basically built around rd350 parts thats why the guy that runs it is constantly after 350 bottom ends. The motors unproven, never been tested and still isn't running correctly.

If you want 500cc, buy a 350 lump, a long stroke crank and some cheeta barrels. It'd cost 3k tops.

[fredie]

you have inside info?

[JBond]

I can't see who is going to pay for one of their 500cc motors...... its basically built around rd350 parts thats why the guy that runs it is constantly after 350 bottom ends. The motors unproven, never been tested and still isn't running correctly.

If you want 500cc, buy a 350 lump, a long stroke crank and some cheeta barrels. It'd cost 3k tops.

"A 350 lump, a long stroke crank and some cheeta barrels." Isn't that what they're 500cc motor basically consists of?

"still isn't running correctly." Just like every other tuned LC, right? Remember when Bike did "The cult of Elsie". Part of the joy of the Chelsea bridge to Heston services run was watching a group of guys in bomber jackets and simson helmets gathered round a blown LC and then watching them try and get it home. "You haven't lived till you've done 90 on the M4 flyover on the end of a long scarf."

[WIGARUS]

I can't see who is going to pay for one of their 500cc motors...... its basically built around rd350 parts thats why the guy that runs it is constantly after 350 bottom ends. The motors unproven, never been tested and still isn't running correctly.

If you want 500cc, buy a 350 lump, a long stroke crank and some cheeta barrels. It'd cost 3k tops.

That is a MAJOR oversimplification. the TSS motor is way more advanced than a long stroked cheetah. Where to start?

On anything with larger than 68mm bore or over +4mm stroke, the cases have to be machined to take the crank and barrels. that is a cost.

The TSS cranks are perfectly weighted and are available in either 180 or 90 degree firing order.

The pistons have anti friction coatings on the skirts and ceramic coating on the crowns.

The motors are running straight cut primary gears as well as flywheels that are 50% of the weight of the RD items. this means that they are able to use heavy duty roller bearings in the cranks.

The carbs, inlets and reeds are all specifically designed for their motor.

The powervalves are a TSS designed hybrid of the cheetah pressure activated PVs and the yamaha YPVS system.

The engine will be running on oil injection. There are very few large capacity two strokes that aaren't running premix.

There is a lot more to this, however I think I have made my point.

To say that you could just grab some cases and add 3 grand is just laughable. I am building a 421cc motor to put into my TZR, and the cost (even in pounds ) is well over that already, without having pipes finished.