Slipper Clutch, STM or Sigma?

[stupid luke]

I dont usually post on here because I am a technophobe and a thicko innit.

But I am after a slipper clutch for my Superduke track bike.

I always said I would get an STM as they look like a work of art but they are big money and I wont see it once it is behind the new reinforced clutch cover.

Otherwise, Sigma are local to me and I always liked Neil Spalding on Moto GP. Until I phoned him once, now I think he is an ignorant slap head and dont really want to put a pound in his pocket unless the Sigma is as good or better than the STM.

Anybody got experience of either? Or of either of the dealers I would use for the supply / fit; HM Racing for STM or Steve Jordan for Sigma? Anybody got any connections, inside information or indiscreet photographs I can use for price negotiation with either supplier?

And dont tell me just to blip it on downchanges, never let common sense get in the way of a great bike bling purchase.

[spacemonkey]

I dont usually post on here because I am a technophobe and a thicko innit.

But I am after a slipper clutch for my Superduke track bike.

I always said I would get an STM as they look like a work of art but they are big money and I wont see it once it is behind the new reinforced clutch cover.

Otherwise, Sigma are local to me and I always liked Neil Spalding on Moto GP. Until I phoned him once, now I think he is an ignorant slap head and dont really want to put a pound in his pocket unless the Sigma is as good or better than the STM.

Anybody got experience of either? Or of either of the dealers I would use for the supply / fit; HM Racing for STM or Steve Jordan for Sigma? Anybody got any connections, inside information or indiscreet photographs I can use for price negotiation with either supplier?

And dont tell me just to blip it on downchanges, never let common sense get in the way of a great bike bling purchase.

I've got a Sigma on one of my bikes. It does what is says on the tin and I'm happy!

What did Neil Spalding say to upset you?

[chance]

ive got a sigma on my gsxr and could be happier with it. i fitted it myself as tbh its a pretty easy job really.

[stupid luke]

I've got a Sigma on one of my bikes. It does what is says on the tin and I'm happy!

What did Neil Spalding say to upset you?

I had a query on a slipper clutch for my fireblade. It wasnt one of his, to be fair but we have friends in common so I thought I would chance a phonecall and ask for a bit of advice.

I have always admired the way Spalding explians technical Moto GP stuff on Eurospurt and made a point of telling him so. However, during the short, terse conversation I still got the feeling his interest was purely monetary; If he couldnt sell me something I was wasting his time.

Maybe I caught him at a bad moment and in fairness it was a couple of years back when Eurospurt had lost the Moto GP gig so maybe it wasnt the best time to bring that up. However, I have since mentioned it to the guys that know him and suggested I call him in the first place and they werent suprised.

Shame because it now makes me reluctant to go for a Sigma, which his company import but do not make, as I would expect short shrift on any aftercare if it were needed.

[spacemonkey]

I had a query on a slipper clutch for my fireblade. It wasnt one of his, to be fair but we have friends in common so I thought I would chance a phonecall and ask for a bit of advice.

I have always admired the way Spalding explians technical Moto GP stuff on Eurospurt and made a point of telling him so. However, during the short, terse conversation I still got the feeling his interest was purely monetary; If he couldnt sell me something I was wasting his time.

Maybe I caught him at a bad moment and in fairness it was a couple of years back when Eurospurt had lost the Moto GP gig so maybe it wasnt the best time to bring that up. However, I have since mentioned it to the guys that know him and suggested I call him in the first place and they werent suprised.

Shame because it now makes me reluctant to go for a Sigma, which his company import but do not make, as I would expect short shrift on any aftercare if it were needed.

I only ask because it was a bit different to my experience. I had a conversation with him once and it sounds like the guy gets an awful lot of people coming to him for support on clutches he hasn't sold! - Maybe he's got a bit hypersensitive to this and didn't have too much patience! - I imagine it is hard enough work to keep dealing with guys that have bought a clutch from him!

[johnnymack63]

I only ask because it was a bit different to my experience. I had a conversation with him once and it sounds like the guy gets an awful lot of people coming to him for support on clutches he hasn't sold! - Maybe he's got a bit hypersensitive to this and didn't have too much patience! - I imagine it is hard enough work to keep dealing with guys that have bought a clutch from him!

Quite possibly, but

1) That's the way the world turns in business. People shop around, people always want something for nothing these days, not every phone call is a piece of gift wrapped business and when it isn't you have to be prepared to play a longer game. I know so many people that work in or own bike dealers up and own the country and how they get through each day without loosing their temper at "customers" is a wonder. I'd say a good 80% of every enquiery a dealership gets is either just price checking or being asked to sort out A.N. Other dealers fuck up. Hoowever, in most cases the good/successfull dealerships just grit their teeth and knuckle down for the longer game.

and

2) Manners cost nothing.

On you question of which clutch, the only thing I can add to whats already been said is that any after market slipper clutch (like after market suspension) is only as good as you set it up to be. I rode Matts Speed Triple a couple of weeks ago which has just has a Sigma put into it. I absoutly hated it. However, what I hated about it was the way Matt has it set up. If I was keeping the bike I would have to change its settings.

Both clutchs are of the highest quality and will do what they say on the tin but their set up is what really matters

[MonkeyJim]

I've got a Sigma one fitted in the R1*

I bought it second hand off ebay and it didn't come with any destructions. I called Neil and he couldn't have been more helpful, as it turned out it was missing a couple of parts, which he sorted for me straight away, even though he was about to leave for the airport to go to a round of motoGP.

10/10 from me

*BTW it's bloody brilliant.

[fran9r]

Quite possibly, but

1) That's the way the world turns in business. People shop around, people always want something for nothing these days, not every phone call is a piece of gift wrapped business and when it isn't you have to be prepared to play a longer game. I know so many people that work in or own bike dealers up and own the country and how they get through each day without loosing their temper at "customers" is a wonder. I'd say a good 80% of every enquiery a dealership gets is either just price checking or being asked to sort out A.N. Other dealers fuck up. Hoowever, in most cases the good/successfull dealerships just grit their teeth and knuckle down for the longer game.

For a dealer, yes. Sigma is a bit more specialist than a general dealer enquiry though, and is unlikely to get anything from that type of enquiry, unless the purpose was to swop to Sigma (it sounds like it wasen't).

Neil seems a sound bloke, his website it full of technical info on his clutches and Ducati's in paticular. In light of that I think it's prefectly fair he dosen't discuss the setup of something he hasen't designed, installed or sold to customers. But yeah, he should have politely explained that.

[spacemonkey]

Quite possibly, but

1) That's the way the world turns in business. People shop around, people always want something for nothing these days, not every phone call is a piece of gift wrapped business and when it isn't you have to be prepared to play a longer game. I know so many people that work in or own bike dealers up and own the country and how they get through each day without loosing their temper at "customers" is a wonder. I'd say a good 80% of every enquiery a dealership gets is either just price checking or being asked to sort out A.N. Other dealers fuck up. Hoowever, in most cases the good/successfull dealerships just grit their teeth and knuckle down for the longer game.

Yeah, on the other hand I imagine a lot of companies selling this stuff can sell it for rock bottom price because they offer no support. They do the easy bit. Then their confused customers go on the hunt for the nearest mug who knows how to help them.

2) Manners cost nothing.

Quite right... Easier said than done when you are under pressure to sort 101 things for paying customers though!

[Timbo S2]

I have the Ducati Corse item, which I beleive is a Bucci...

Outer basket and plates are wearing, so I may look at a Sigma item next, as meny seem to have nothing but praise for them.

[hamill12]

STM for me......

Every other brand of slipper clutch I've used personally or worked on on race bikes has been a pain in the arse...with Suter being the worst.

Millemille what was the problem with the Suter. I bought a Suter for a k2 1000 but have not fitted it yet...

Should i get rid. and look for a different unit?

[speedy sie]

just a quick one Mike .wot are the factory xro sliper cluches like for were and set up?..and are they eny good?

[stupid luke]

I've got a Sigma one fitted in the R1*

I bought it second hand off ebay and it didn't come with any destructions. I called Neil and he couldn't have been more helpful, as it turned out it was missing a couple of parts, which he sorted for me straight away, even though he was about to leave for the airport to go to a round of motoGP.

10/10 from me

*BTW it's bloody brilliant.

I am sure you are right. If the used slipper I had bought had turned out to be badged Sigma instead of just an identical model built in the same factory in Czech without the Sigma badge and if I had wanted to buy parts for it I am sure Spalding would have shown an interest long enough to get my credit card number at least.

As it is, the nameless Sigma like clutch sits unloved in my garage until I sell it at a loss on e bay and I will most likely try an STM on my Superduke.

[speedy sie]

thank Mike

[hamill12]

All of the Suter ones I've worked with are very, very fussy on pack thickness and spring tension.

A difference in pack thickness that an STM would be happy to accommodate had Suter's slipping under power and being very grabby yet when you put a new plate/plates in the pack it won't disengage properly. I found I had to keep a whole range of worn or part worn steels and friction plates in my work bench and use them to create exactly the right pack thickness on an annoyingly regular basis. When Hawk were using the Suter clutches on the ZX7RR's in BSB it was almost a full time job keeping on top of them.

They seem very, very sensitive to spring tension and supposedly identical identical springs had them behaving in wildly differing ways.

Thanks for the info Mike.